Curse

DreamWind · Sep 11, 2007, 11:55 PM // 23:55

I have found VIDEO evidence that shows Guild Wars the way it was meant to be played.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lmnEWvo1Ugw

This video contains several topics worthy of discussion, but I want to focus on 1 specifically. The comments of the ArenaNet founders on this video...particularly Mike O'Brien. Pay close attention.

So...what the hell happened to Guild Wars?? Discuss.

LumpOfCole · Sep 12, 2007, 12:01 AM // 00:01

It got bigger and more complex and much harder to balance with the current campaign and expansion model. Many lessons have been learned and shall be applied to Guild Wars 2 from the beginning. Obviously, the most difficult part is balancing PvE and PvP, and building content in newer products valuable to both camps, and balanced with each other. It's kind of a relief that the two will be more seperated (reportedly) in GW2.

Right now, it's not the most perfect product in the world, but incredibally enjoyable and I can't wait to see what Anet does with GW2.

Sergeant of Marines · Sep 12, 2007, 12:04 AM // 00:04

Why can't we just let PvP die in peace, it has been ruined for some time now, that is why I really do not bother anymore...

Live and learn and on to GW2, hope it will have everything everyone asks for in it, otherwise, every thread on Guru, will just be repeated.

wilebill · Sep 12, 2007, 12:14 AM // 00:14

What happened was a strange contradiction in game design. First PvE and PvP were separate, which is fine. No problem with that decision.

But then PvE and PvP skills were linked together, which meant that as numbers of skills increased and PvE environments grew more popular it became harder to maintain PvP balance without losing PvE players who were responsible for a good part of game sales.

A famous game designer once said PvE and PvP mix like oil and water. Situation here. Hopefully, GW2 will have a solution to the problem that will please both the PvE and PvP factions.

Bryant Again · Sep 12, 2007, 12:17 AM // 00:17

Man, were those good days...

makosi · Sep 12, 2007, 12:20 AM // 00:20

Good watch. I never realised that those events were so popular with as many spectators and Mike O'brien and Jeff Strain were extremely enthusiastic and seem to be pleased with what they have achieved.

Off-topic: Why do all Americans have such good teeth? Are they fake or what or just really well maintained?!

A11Eur0 · Sep 12, 2007, 12:23 AM // 00:23

Lookit that thar first comment. Sheer genius.

haggus71 · Sep 12, 2007, 12:26 AM // 00:26

Makosi: One word - braces. A staple of millions of middle school/high school kids. Plus we drink more milk. Got a shitload of cattle here.

Remember the good old days, guys? Back in the third grade?
-Eric Cartman

Gigashadow · Sep 12, 2007, 12:27 AM // 00:27

What happened was, they realised the vast majority of their customerbase were more interested in PvE, and were fairly casual players anyway. I can totally understand that, but it's a shame, because I loved GW's PvP. Still, I had my fun when the going was good, and I'll always have the fondest memories of the gale warrior + dom mesmer era.

Healers Wisper · Sep 12, 2007, 12:33 AM // 00:33

people happened to guild wars. often times in industry, consumer demand dictates the direction a product will go. more people like the pve aspect of this game so their direction changed. Its not hard to see that. while in these forums the PvP population is very loud, it isn't even the majority of the players that post here. there have been polls to back this statement. this can also be seen by the relattively small number of guilds that largely dominate the PvP.

It is fairly easy for a new player to play in the PvE environment, but the current PvP game makes it difficult for even experienced PvE players to get involved more than AB or TA

Personally I am glad ANET changed its direction. I find PvP frustratring to say the least. I also find PvP to be relatively repetative and boring. I would have left the game long ago if the game was dominated by PvP.

gg ANET.

I MP I · Sep 12, 2007, 12:34 AM // 00:34

Yaay. The days before the game started to suck ass. IMO. PvP was worth playing and watching back then.

EternalTempest · Sep 12, 2007, 02:09 AM // 02:09

The Original GW was designed to do pve, then as an end game do pvp. There was zero batlazar faction originally and you had to do unlocks via pve for your pvp. That's why they had "short cuts" droks run with duplicate elite capping and max (less armor) npc item traders in both the desert and the s.shiverpeaks.
Batlazar faction came latter, the "removal" of the attribute refund system came latter.

The lead dev actually admitted pve was developed 1st in an interview. That being said, the pvp 1st vs pve 1st is irrelevant.

Gw was designed to do both they try to juggle both... and the result Nightfall and Eotn are very pve based with plans to offer pve and a pvp pve style as well as a separate structured and balanced pvp in GW2.

lyra_song · Sep 12, 2007, 03:06 AM // 03:06

The PvE uses the PvP engine, albeit with modified tactics.

I forsee this thread as blaming PvE for the collapse of PvP.

So ill go sit and watch.

maraxusofk · Sep 12, 2007, 03:32 AM // 03:32

I BLAME U SILLY PVE'ERS FOR THE COLLAPSE OF PVP

honestly though, pvp died when ppl got bored of seeing the same builds every 2 runs. i farmed my first r9 during the era of iway and b spike, which was fun for the first 2 days. when i came back to farm r10 the game was slightly funner (beginning of 6v6 and reintroduction of 8v8). i am not suprised many people quit pvp cuz it got repetitive. most ppl who ha nowadays do it jsut to get emotes, as the ha items are now in eotn.

i hafta say though, i started as a hardcore pve'er and switched and basically joined pvp for 1 ½ years, now im back into pve going for r4 koabd. Hahah funny how obsessed I am with this game no?

RSGashapon · Sep 12, 2007, 03:51 AM // 03:51

Um... tough crap?

Video games aren't sports.

Sorry, but I fail to see how competitions like that can be considered fun.

Vinraith · Sep 12, 2007, 04:40 AM // 04:40

Quote:

The Original GW was designed to do pve, then as an end game do pvp.

That's the sense I always got back in the days of Prophecies. The problem is, the two playstyles are radically different, and appeal to different people. A casual PvE player doesn't particularly WANT to have to play against other people in a high competition, high stress environment. That's not what they play the game for. Similarly a PvP player that thrives on that kind of visceral competition is going to be bored to death by the more plodding and cautious pace of PvE. It was a neat idea and a neat experiment, and I think Anet's learned from it and (largely) gone the right way with that knowledge. We'll see what happens with GW2. I just hope they don't screw over the solo PvE crowd...

Vinraith · Sep 12, 2007, 04:43 AM // 04:43

Quote:

hope it will have everything everyone asks for in it

Surely you realize that's impossible. First off, half the suggestions on this board contradict one another. Second, even if everything here came true you'd have a NEW horde of disgruntled players demanding that it be changed in some other way (and a hell of a lot of people calling for it to be changed BACK). Never forget that for every complaint thread you see here there's a number of happy players that like the game the way it is.

Foe · Sep 12, 2007, 04:53 AM // 04:53

but its like pve was better then too...now u grind titles?? prophesies pve was billion times better...and pvp could be fixed! they just wont do it! lol..i guess they dont wanna piss off the mm's. which is sad..cause it doesnt really matter what u run in pve...like really. Ive pve'd as much as nice guy but cmooooooooooon. fix it =)

fenix · Sep 12, 2007, 04:53 AM // 04:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by RSGashapon

Um... tough crap?

Video games aren't sports.

Sorry, but I fail to see how competitions like that can be considered fun.

So says you. I think otherwise. Competing against other teams is MUCH more fun than grinding stupid AI.

As for video games as sports, have you heard of CPL before? Here's a link so you can educate yourself.

Yichi · Sep 12, 2007, 04:56 AM // 04:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by RSGashapon

Sorry, but I fail to see how competitions like that can be considered fun.

Because you're not a competitive person. To a competitive person who plays PvP in this game, those kind of tournaments are the best